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August 24, 2011
Court Hearings, The Rule of Law Contempt of court, Habeas Corpus, Human rights, Kenneth Clarke, Leeds, London, Royal Courts of Justice, World War II 28 Comments
Tomorrow morning, 10.30 is the hearing before Justice Wyn Williams in Court 28 at the Royal Courts of Justice.
The hearing is listed under “Applications for Permission“
on
http://www.justice.gov.uk/guidance/courts-and-tribunals/courts/hearing-lists/list-cause-rcj.htm
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Aug 24, 2011 @ 15:39:36
… fingers crossed !
Aug 24, 2011 @ 15:58:05
good luck!
Aug 24, 2011 @ 15:59:03
thanks for keeping us up to date maggie.
i have only just joined your emailing circle, I was concerned to read the response about how easy it was to submit an application to withdraw a contempt of court certificate, is norman being tucked up by his helpers?
or did the poster not understand the case.
what was the trial norman was caught taping?
is there anywhere we can get a pdf of his book?
what medication is being withheld from him, and why?
I am all for exposing the abuse and fraud, cover ups and lies in the system, but to do so we need more facts, cold solid facts that people can not argue with.
this is the email that has concerned me, if his defence can have him free in a few hours why is poor norman still inside?
From Peter Mon 22 August 11
An Open letter Regarding Norman
To Chris Jarvis and Norman’s supporters.
Dear all,
I can no longer stand by and see people hoodwinked over Normans case , when he could have and should have released a couple of weeks ago (by applying to purge his contempt).
Let me expand and explain; it is in reality irrelevant what a Judge sentences a person to as he has the power to sentence in Contempt of Court cases with immediate effect anything up to 2 years in prison.
Under the law it is illegal to record without permission of the Court and Norman is therefore technically guilty, the only question is quantum.
So for people to say the it was illegal and to say he has not had a trial , etc is nonsense.
Norman evidently apologised before being sentenced but people are now missing the point that was BEFORE being sentenced. .
What you do, is very simple . You write a letter to the Court for the attention of the Judge saying you wish to purge your contempt. The Court should then immediately list a hearing and the person is brought before the Judge and if the person apologises the person is released.
The idea being that the prison shocks some sense into you and you now apologise. If a Judge did then refuse to release you, you would have a very good appeal point.
If you did not want to be released straight away and did not want to apologise then you have to appeal and apply for bail, but this takes longer and forms have to be filled in as opposed to a simple letter.
Another point that some people have misunderstood is the Queen has no power of pardon. The Government took that right away from her years ago. Any petition to the Queen might look good for PR but in reality has no legal effect.
If my memory serves me correctly , on contempt of court cases there is no time off for good behaviour, etc, so 6 Months means 6 Months not out in say 3 months.
Habeas Corpus can only be used when you have exhausted all other rights of appeal/ purge contempt and as such a Habeous Corpus application that is premature runs the risk of being dismissed.
If the Governor does not comply with a Habeas corpus application, you can ask for him to be fined. This is still on the statute books , though the amount has remained the same, from memory £500.
A Hapeas Corpus application that is premature and dismissed runs the risk of a whacking great cost order against the applicant.
So let’s start at the beginning. I received an email out of the blue telling me of Norman’s plight giving sparse details other than the where to send a card to at the prison. I immediately emailed other prominent litigants to spread the word . I then tried to find out more details and was met with a wall of cloak and dagger.
I was then put in touch with Chris Jarvis who is supposed to be Norman’s friend and lives a couple of miles away from the prison. Rather than too many cooks spoil the broth, it seemed sensible to coordinate any action through Chris Jarvis , and he could arrange a visit or drop anything in by hand to the prison as he is on the spot.
Instead of being able to help Norman I then ran into problems. The Judge name was a secret, the Court name was a secret and these people were supposed to be helping Norman. For anyone to be able a try and help Norman we needed further details. It was then divulged it was not Normans case and he witnessed someone else s case, and to this day whose ever case it was is still for some reason top secret.
Then I was told that it was a County Court Judge at the Bradford Combined courts giving the impression this was a civil contempt. I introduce Terry To Chris. Terry is one of the most experienced and best person you could have regarding forms, case law, skeletons , etc.
Terry sent to Norman in Prison the civil contempt appeal forms.
I emailed Chris Jarvis a template letter to hand/ send Norman to write to the County Court to purge his contempt. All Norman would have to do is sign it and send it off. He would then be allocated a hearing and supporters could have come to his hearing.
A demo was then organised with the bus outside the prison, when if the purge contempt letter had in fact been sent, this bus could have gone to a hearing for Norman’s release.
Chris Jarvis made a Habeas Corpus application despite this is only supposed to be used when you have exhausted all your other remedies first. It was only then that we were told out that Norman’s case was at a Criminal court, not a county court at all. So the draft purge letter I had sent would have needed to be amended. Terry then resent Norman to the prison , Criminal appeals forms and bail form.
I asked Chris Jarvis to send us a copy of his application and who he had made it out to, so we could suggest / help. But no, it was top secret again. I would have suggested he served the Secretary of state for good measure, and as I suspected he had not, and this turned out to be true.
It is all very well saying Norman has not received something or is denied something, but proving it is another matter. But again all this “evidence “ was top secret.
As we all know, the hearing in the High Court was adjourned and I was told by someone at the hearing that the Judge mentioned the proper course was to appeal, but this fact is surprisingly absent from the round robin emails since!
So having discovered that this was a criminal case in the crown court and not a country court case at all, I asked Chris Jarvis to confirm that he had in fact sent my draft purge of contempt letter to Norman. Instead of receiving a yes or a no, I received a slagging off email which makes me think he hasn’t.
So I then tried posting a copy of my email on the website for Norman and Chris Jarvis as presumable moderator refused to allow it be published and emailed me back . So the very notion that Norman fought for this country for freedom and free speech is being denied and hypocritical by censoring messages on Norman’s own site!
Chris Jarvis has now emailed “come along to Thursdays hearing and watch history in the making”.
I could quite easily sit back and say nothing, and watch history in the making in the form I believe will see Chris Jarvis stuffed .
The reason for this is as follows . The Judge has been very clever by adjourning the case .
The Governor has been ordered to assist with the appeal . The Secretary of State has been ordered to be served. No doubt he will employ the Treasury Solicitors to represent him and they in turn will employ Counsel , with fees running in to thousands of pounds.
So Chris Jarvis’ argument that Norman has been denied forms, legal representation, whatever has now been shot out of the water.
So let’s go through the options available for the judge on Thursday :
a) He is a very nice man, and believed the Prison are still denying Norman and releases him.
b) If Norman has now lodged an appeal, the Judge dismisses the Habeas Corpus application, as the other remedies have to be tried first.
c) If Norman has not yet lodged an appeal, the Judge says: well, the Governor is now assisting Norman, and he should get on with his appeal, Habeas Corpus dismissed.
d) Having dismissed the Habeas Corpus , the Judge then orders Chris Jarvis to personally pay all the costs of the other side forthwith, which he hearby assesses as X amount of thousands of pounds.
So, where does that leave us. We have no evidence Chris Jarvis has authority to act for Norman. If he has, then it would be very easy for him to fax or email today the Crown Court with a copy of his authority to act on behalf of Norman today to purge his contempt.
Then having rung for an immediate hearing date, ask the other side to consent to adjourn Thursday’s High Court hearing until after the purge application is heard.
Chris has nothing to lose by sending this letter, but everything to gain. If he does not believe me, then send it and prove me wrong. If the appeal is lodged, then it may be possible to substitute the Thursday hearing for the bail application.
Whatever happens: if Thursday hearing is just left for Habeas Corpus, then I can foresee Chris Jarvis being stuffed.
I would add that today in the news a looter who stole from a shop in Ealing has been given a caution by the Police , this looter is the oldest so far, at 70 years old. So there are plenty of arguments in support that Norman should be released, the easiest is to purge your contempt.
So people know here is the suggested letter that could have had Norman released weeks ago that I have been referring to amended to Crown Court address and date:
Bradford Law Courts Date 22nd August 2011
Exchange Square .
Drake Street . Bradford … West Yorksire
BD1 1JA
By Email / Fax To :
Attention His Honour Judge Rose,
REQUEST TO PURGE CONTEMPT OF COURT
Further to hearing ?? July 11 at Bradford Combined Court Centre where His Honour Judge Rose sentenced myself Norman Scarth to 6 Months in prison and banned from entering court premises
for a year.
I confirm I wish to purge my contempt and apologise to the Court and / or the Judge and request an urgent hearing before His Honour Judge Rose or if he is not available an urgent hearing before another Judge.
As I am 85 years old, I give Bradford Combined Court centre permission under the data protection act to also divulge details of my case and discuss my case and hearing date with my friend Chris Jarvis of …. address …..
Yours faithfully,
Signed
Norman Scarth Ref A1903CF
Leeds Prison
2 Gloucester Terrace
Stanningly Road
Leeds
LSD 2 DJ
cc John Hemming MP
House of Commons
( Look up address … post code,etc)
cc Chris Jarvis
something does not make sense maggie, perhaps you could explain it one way or the other.
thank you for bring this to the attention of the public, the press as usual are keeping it hidden.
Steve.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 16:11:34
Dear Steve
I can only answer partly. Look at the petition (top button on the right) for more details and the Justice for Norman Scarth website. The post “Background Facts” on this blog is the best we got.
His book may be on the site of Sharon Kilby.
The legal knowledge of victims is of course not “equally distributed”. So far, Chris Jarvis believes he knows best…
Aug 24, 2011 @ 17:12:16
Hi Sabine,
Thanks for your response, I am new to this www forum, I was puzzled by the first email that came through as it basically said poor norman was being held but could be out within a few hours, I am not a legal expert, but that post seemed to be written by someone who knows the law.
I watched the videos of norman on you tube, I would not like to think he is being used and abused by friends as well as the system.
Has anyone contacted brian gerrish?
he knows whats what, I have heard him speak many times on tpuc and sov independent radio, if people clubbed together and paid his petrol he would probably defend and have norman out on the day.
I see that trend blocks access to this blogg,says its dangerous…..lols, the corporate power of the military establishments arm has grown strong.
I will check out sharon kilbys www.
I checked lots of links on here to dig deeper into the case but could not find the answers I was trying to find.
lets hope norman is let out tomorrow, but if the response-email is correct he could be getting himself deeper into trouble, hence i mention checking it out with brian.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 16:14:30
I noticed in the TV report that Chris Jarvis was introduced as a “legal expert” rather than “solicitor” or “barrister.” I am not sure at all who Peter is.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 16:23:35
Chris Jarvis publishes Social Services Hell and claims to be Norman’s Friend. I did notice that label about him…
Peter Barnes is one of the ‘victims turned starfighters’ whose “knowledge from experience” I value.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 16:36:26
I wasn’t sure whether it was relevant, but it was something that stuck in my mind.
It seemed to me that Mr Barnes has given this matter a lot of thought and he definitely appears to know what he is talking about. I will look at Mr Jarvis’ website as well, so I can form an opinion about his credentials as well – I guess one of them has to be wrong.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 17:25:19
It seemed to me that Mr Barnes has given this matter a lot of thought and he definitely appears to know what he is talking about. I will look at Mr Jarvis’ website as well, so I can form an opinion about his credentials as well – I guess one of them has to be wrong.
yes, that was my thinking, norman needs to be protected from the system, he needs real legal advice otherwise he is just getting himself deeper into trouble.
if they bang on fees and such his life will get so much harder than it is now.
we will see I guess.
fingers and toes crossed.
Steve..
Aug 24, 2011 @ 17:41:28
I’m not sure whether Brian Gerrish has been informed. But my impression is that between Norman and Chris there is not much more one can do until after the hearing tomorrow.
Amazing how signatures and comments are still flooding in for him! Really nice to see and know!
Thanks for your interest and support, too!
Aug 24, 2011 @ 17:55:25
You are a great publicist Sabine – I am sure it will have a good effect tomorrow.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 18:05:33
brian has a lot of clout, I would have liked to have seen him involved, but its to late now either way i guess.
yes, i saw your petition was growing well, is it on the govts e petition www?
i see the leave the eu express-ukip one is slowly growing, the last time I looked it was at 18,000, not many people can know about it, its a moot point as the treasonous dave has said no anyway, but it would be nice to see the little man squirm and squiggle as it was debated.
nice to find a forum that’s protecting others rights.
.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 18:10:58
Steve – I know it’s a bit off-message, but do you have a link to the EU petition?
Aug 24, 2011 @ 19:00:03
No, the petition is hosted by GoPetition who are clearly the right kind of people.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 21:26:41
Yes, I do not doubt you know what you are doing, and go petition are used to hosting these things.
I just assumed now the govt have a www petition page it would be on there, I meant no offence.I hope none was taken.
steve.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 21:04:08
http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/356
up to 22,ooo now, the govt are being sneaky, there seems to be other ones under the same thing, guess it dilutes the vote.
if norman is not free by tomorrow then I think this should go on there, it will get more chance of coverage………………….. the more the better.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 21:14:47
I agree with both your points Steve
1. There is a definite attempt to dilute the anti-EU movement.
2. Norman’s campaign may gain even more coverage if a petition is started on e-petitions.
Aug 24, 2011 @ 21:35:48
The very best of luck and it will be luck not justice in the English courts
Aug 24, 2011 @ 21:43:49
mmm when I signed the eu petition it took 6 attempts to read the second word they give you as a pass word, I even tried to listen to it as there is an option for that, it sounded like gobbledy gook, my wife signed the following day but did not get a conformation email, a few days later she re-signed it, that went through ok.
however it pays to persevere,
yes, maybe putting it on the govt www as well as go-petitions, I do not want to change anything here, just pointing out there are lots of options.
I am sure go-petitions are fine, but I do know that some petition www are almost like controlled opposition, they look impressive but go nowhere.
lets hope norman is let out and is a freeman, if not there is the govt www petition option.
may as well use it,
if its on a uk www our mps can not ignore it.
, ,
Aug 25, 2011 @ 10:52:34
Brian Gerrish is definitely the right person to expose corruption within the government and the courts, I would trust him over and above any others, it does seem rather interesting that MPs /campaigners/media seem reluctant to work with him, could be because he is doing such a good job, I am sure he would be very keen to hear from you Sabine and John Hemming.
Aug 25, 2011 @ 11:11:40
hi, I have just been down to the court link, also on the same day, same courts you will see this listed………………………hidden but listed.
COMMERCIAL COURT LIST
COURT 11
Before MR JUSTICE BLAIR
Thursday 25 August 2011
At 10:30
2011-994 British Arab Commercial Bank Plc V The National Transitional Council of The State Libya
now thats blairs brother, so what have we here, gold or oil grab, just as we are told libya has been taken over by the brits french and other eu helpers…………
Is norman being used as a smoke screen by the law……………….
I trust brian gerrish 100%.
but lets hope he is not needed and norman gets out today.
steve.
Aug 25, 2011 @ 12:23:32
THANKS, Anon,
I sent him an email.
Aug 29, 2011 @ 11:26:47
has brian been in contact Sabine?
how did norman react to being given yet another week inside?
there has been no press coverage…………..its all gone quiet.
many thanks.
steve.
Aug 25, 2011 @ 13:16:59
Mps treat a petition as one bit of paper. They count paper, so each supporter must write/email/ individually about the cause they support, in their own words, to their own MP. If the volume is high enough, they take some notice… eg forestry privatisation
Yu can find your mp address email from THEYWORKFORYOU.com
When writing to mp, you should include your address, within their constituency, otherwise they will ignore it. They pass it on to the relevant minister, who tries to ignore it but volume speaks louder than words. Also ask for Freedom of information requests pertinent to the issue, and let us know your results.
Aug 29, 2011 @ 10:58:50
So what happened about Norman?
Aug 29, 2011 @ 11:21:56
I gather he is still inside until the early part of september, then another court case.
I subscribed to the emails from here.
hope this helps.
steve.
Aug 29, 2011 @ 11:36:55
No, sorry, Steve, Brian has not responded.
But I don’t think that he’s the kind of legal expert that is needed now. There are very good guys working on preparing documents for the next stage: an appeal.
I keep sending emails to Norman but don’t hear back. So I don’t know how he’s taking to it all. But on video he is supposed to have said “I don’t care whether I’m freed or not…” For he knows that the public is on his side – as evidenced by the analysis of the comments!!!
Aug 29, 2011 @ 12:33:27
mmm sadly norman is not really helping himself, i say that in a kindly way, if as was posted about his statement of his so called contempt of court is correct he must at least seem partly sorry, contrite in the sight of the law and courts.
now both you and i know he isnt sorry, he has no reason to be sorry the miserable bustards who put him inside should be sorry, not norman, but justice is blind deaf and dumb, an illusion, everyone knows that.
he is stuck in limbo, as a freeman of england he has caused neither loss or harm…………………. but the system is rigged, and sadly you have to play them and act the poor sorry applicant – supplicant for the queens mercy.
I am surprised about brian not responding, but he may have been contacted by the ones who are representing him and told to leave them to it.
there are still facts that are unknown, as i pointed out when i posted my first message up on your blog,
Maybe norman has not got the funds to reply to your emails, I looked up the costs of the prison, daylight robbery comes to mind.
I was minded to send a few bob, but i do not trust the system to be honest, if i lived within 30 miles i would go and see him, but i am 300 miles away.
i saw in the daily mail a child abuser got out despite a 238 year sentence, yet norman is inside……………….. english law at work.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2031013/Notorious-paedophile-jailed-238-years-abusing-children-free-mingle-children-car-boot-sale.html
what more can you say about british justice……………….
its a joke.
but it is not funny, its sick.
thanks for keeping us up to date.
steve.